deathcard19

ok so im seriously thinkin bout puttin together a bike, but the main thing im unsure of is what type of engine im gonna put in. i want a shovelhead but not too sure of the pros and cons of them. can anyone help me out with them?

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GeezerGlide

Go with an evo, last longer than the old cast cyls. Heads are much better design also. Bottom end is basiclly the same.

deathcard19

thanks, yea an evo was my other choice, id like to find a kicker that i could install on an evo if i do go that route

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GeezerGlide

If I remember correctly, there is or was a kit for the old 5 speed tranny, but if you cant find a kit ,its the same parts the 4 speeds had. The mainshafts had a groove machined and threads on the end ,for kicker gears. Than its just a matter of the cover and internals.One of the pros of the shovel IMO was that stroker motors ran stronger than the Evo's.

deathcard19

ok im gonna check it out and see if i can find that kit on the web. the shovelhead stroker is that another way of saying bored out?

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GeezerGlide

No "stroker" Implies different flywheels with a different crankshaft position , like S&S wheels, but if ya have stock cases, they will have to be relieved for the crank nut clearance , Stay away from Big Bore Kits, the results leave alot to be desired. If I remember right , 88" is good with stock cyls. anything over wiil need spacer plates on a true stroker. On shovels , stay away from the 1980- 80", lot of probs blowing head gaskets.

sk8rod

go shovel,, evos are dull

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deathcard19

thanks for clearing up what stroker means i was told by someone to try and stay away from shovels that were produced when amf owned h-d but seems like most of them were made in that time frame

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deathcard19

yea man a shovel is what i want, but i havent been able to find one too reasonably priced yet compared to its condition

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GeezerGlide

Hey DC19, feel free to PM or e-mail me and I will help ya with the drive train questions. As far as chassis goes there are a few here better to advise ya, like Ric or pete and some others. My shop was a bench work, engine and tranny shop mainly and have not kept up with whats "now" with peripherals IE, frames wheels , etc. I'm willing to help ya any way I can, ask away, but please PM or e-mail.

goodkill365

hey deathcard19, i say you get erics bike, bob it out, sell it then buy your shovel LOD style

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I NEED A VOODOO!!!

NirtDap

ahh man ,,the shovel,,,,im going build a shovel,,,in a couple of years unless i win the lottery first ,, i gotta get some things payed off,,,like my street bob,,,,,One pro for the shovel is it cast iron though out and evos has alum jugs alum,,,heat causes more distortion in alum and due to unequal distribution of stress around the head bolts they tend to change there shape so you get blow by and lose of power in the evo,,,that why the shovel is used in racing ,,plus there lots of high performance part you can get,,,,CON,,,,the evo is machined to one thousandth inch and the shovel is 5 thousandth,,,, CON evo is bolted from the case to the top of the head ,,,shovels uses two sets of shorter bolts - , one set secures the head to the cylinder and the other secures the cylinder to the case,,PRO ,but the shovel is so easy to work on it sick,,,no need for fancy tools ,,you can really fix your bike on side the road with limited tools,,it considered farmer friendly,,,,,But if you keep it torqued and oiled then you should be good,,,they say a shovel can be made more powerful and more reliable than any Evo even though it was originaly designed to be a outboard motor ,,,,PRO you never be cooler than riding vintage ,,,,,,and the shovel is beautiful ,,,note in 74 amf took over ,,so you know ,,,,shovels life 1966 ----1884--,,,in the 1970 upgrades where made to correct power problems,,,,thats just some things i learned from my dad and a lil research ,,,,but i feel in love with a shovel in 1977 ,,it was when i knew i would ride a harley at the tender age of 5 ,,,hope this helps,,,

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sk8rod

You thought about a shovel clone from S&S or the Ultima is a real sic one.

S&S make fcking awesome shit.

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Streamylc

I was gonna say... isn't S&S making clones of shovels, pans, and knuckles?

new school performance with old school looks don't think you can beat that

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GeezerGlide

Just a footnote; '66-'69 shovel was still a generater case bottom end. '69 was when AMF made the puchase of H-D with influx of cash to retool and the alternater case came out in '70. H-D was sold from '70 on , under the AMF badge. Early AMF's where plaqued by poor quality wookmanship and some sabotage at the plant by employee's. Another bit on Evo's, the early cases had problems cracking around the oil pressure switch threads and were allmost impossible to repair. I did a ton of case swaps (to S&S) back then.

harleybodei

but don't they cost a fortune.....

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GeezerGlide

Yep, but the quality is tops.....If ya got the bucks its worth it.

harleybodei

well I guess it would depend on what you plan on doing with the bike......is it a beater/bar hopper where you would plan on wrenching on it all the time then go with a original shovel..........if it's a daily ride then you might wanna spend the extra cash........just my opinion.........

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GeezerGlide

Your on da money,Bodie. He didnt specify what type of build he's doing, just asked about engine pros and cons. There also needs to be taken into account what type of riding and performance issues he might have, but again , he didnt state thet either.

harleybodei

It just makes a big difference on the budget and the persons ability......

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Streamylc

this forum rocks

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sk8rod

this is the Ultima shovel ..

i cant look at it for long without dribbling

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harleybodei

that is cool......have ya ever installed one......

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sk8rod

nope,, believe me y'all will know when i do

i want one for myself,, but i am ever hopeful we will get a full ground up commission soon

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harleybodei

what's the cost for summin like that?

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sk8rod

fckin cheap Bud :

Ultima 96" Shovelhead Engine for Harley Davidsons - eBay (item 130387443514 end time Jan-25-11 06:49:21 PST)

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harleybodei

that's not as bad as I thought..........

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Streamylc

if you take into account finding an old shovel for less than that, all the $$$ to make it run right etc... I think you'd be better off just running on of those new shovels

idk... maybe its just me... If I wanted an old style engine, i'd just get one of the new clones.

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GeezerGlide

Dam it , Streamy, I find myself agreeing with you way to much lately.But your on the money here, would be the right move and a better product. Now quick , say something to me to keep up the feudin. I'm a bagger rider!!!

FLHTom1948

Yes!! built rugged and simple, the shovelhead is and always has been the favorite of drag racers; built to tolerances of +-.005", the motor is very forgiving, imho!